FOURTH DAY.

CONVENTION HALL.

Montgomery, Ala., Friday, May 24, 1901.

The Convention met pursuant to adjournment.

Prayer was offered by Rev. A. L. Andrews of the city.

ROLL CALL.

On a call of the roll of the Convention the following delegates answered to their names:


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CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

Messrs. President,

Glover,

Altman,

Graham (Montgomery),

Ashcraft,

Graham (Talladega),

Banks,

Grant,

Barefield,

Grayson,

Bartlett,

Greer (Calhoun),

Beavers,

Greer (Perry),

Beddow,

Haley,

Bethune,

Handley,

Blackwell,

Harrison,

Boone,

Heflin (Chambers),

Brooks,

Heflin (Randolph),

Browne,

Henderson,

Bulger,

Hinson,

Burnett,

Hodges,

Byars,

Hood,

Carmichael (Colbert),

Howze,

Carmichael (Coffee),

Inge,

Carnathon,

Jackson,

Case,

Jenkins,

Chapman,

Jones (Bibb),

Cobb,

Jones (Hale),

Coleman (Greene),

Jones (Montgomery),

Coleman (Walker),

Jones (Wilcox),

Cornwell,

Kirk,

Craig,

Kirkland,

Cunningham,

Knight,

Cofer,

Ledbetter,

Davis (DeKalb),

Leigh,

Davis (Etowah),

Lomax,

Dent,

Long (Butler),

Duke,

Long (Walker),

Eyster,

Lowe (Jefferson),

Espy,

McMillan (Baldwin),

Ferguson,

McMillan (Wilcox),

Fitts,

Malone,

Fletcher,

Martin,

Foshee,

Maxwell,

Foster,

Merrill,

Freeman,

Miller (Marengo),

Gilmore,

Miller (Wilcox),


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

Moody,

Sanders,

Morrisette,

Sanford,

Mulkey,

Searcy,

Murphree,

Selheimer,

NeSmith,

Sentell,

Norman,

Sloan,

Norwood,

Smith, Mac. A.,

Orates,

Smith, Morgan M.,

O’Neal (Lauderdale),

Sollie,

O’Neill (Jefferson),

Sorrell,

Opp,

Spears,

O’Rear,

Spragins,

Palmer,

Stewart,

Parker (Cullman),

Studdard,

Parker (Elmore),

Tayloe,

Pettus,

Thompson,

Phillips,

Vaughan,

Pillans,

Waddell,

Pitts,

Walker,

Porter,

Watts,

Proctor,

Weakley,

Reese,

Weatherly,

Renfro,

White

Reynolds (Chilton),

Whiteside,

Reynolds (Henry),

Williams (Marengo),

Robinson,

Williams (Elmore),

Rogers (Lowndes),

Wilson (Clarke),

Rogers (Sumter),

Wilson (Washington),

Samford,

Winn.

A quorum was present, one hundred and forty delegates having answered to their names.

JOURNAL.

The Journal of yesterday was read and approved.

LEAVE OF ABSENCE.

Leave of absence was granted as follows:

To Messrs. Almon and Lowe, for to-day and to-morrow; to Mr. Macdonald for to-day; to Mr. Merrill, for to-day.


39

CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

RESOLUTIONS.

Mr. Watts offered the following resolution:

Be it resolved, That with the exception of delegates, officers and employees of this Convention, newspaper reporters, and those especially invited, no one shall be permitted on the floor of the Convention, and the doorkeeper is hereby instructed to enforce this resolution.

The resolution was referred to the Committee on Rules.

Mr. Jackson offered the following resolution:

Resolved, That 500 copies of the platform adopted by the State Democratic Convention of Alabama, on April 19, 1901, be printed and be placed on the desks of the members of this Convention.

The resolution was referred to the Committee on Rules.

Mr. Long, of Walker, offered the following resolution:

Resolved, That 500 copies of the present Constitution of the State of Alabama, as annotated in the Code of Laws of Alabama, be printed in pamphlet, form, for the use of the members of this Convention.

The resolution was referred to the Committee on Rules.

Mr. Reese offered the following resolution:

Whereas, more than nine-tenths of the members of this Convention have, prior to their election, pledged the people of Alabama, that no new Constitution would be adopted without first submitting the same to the people for ratification; now, therefore, be it Resolved, That it is the sense of this Convention that such Constitution as may be adopted by this Convention, shall be submitted to the qualified voters of Alabama for ratification.

Mr. Reese moved that the rules be suspended and that the resolution be put upon its passage.

Mr. Watts moved to strike out the preamble of the resolution.

Mr. Reese, by unanimous consent, agreed to the motion of Mr. Watts, and the resolution, as amended, read as follows:


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

Be it resolved, that it is the sense of this Convention that such Constitution as may be adopted by this Convention, shall be submitted to the qualified voters of Alabama for ratification.

Mr. Lomax offered the following substitute for the resolution offered by Mr. Reese:

Resolved, That it is the sense of this Convention that all the pledges of the Democratic party made in the platform adopted in April, 1901, that “that the Constitution adopted by this Convention shall be submitted to the people,” shall be carried out and fulfilled.

Mr. Brooks demanded the previous question, and resolution, which was ordered.

Mr. Walker moved to table the substitute offered by Mr. Lomax, and the motion prevailed.

The question recurred on the motion of Mr. Reese on a suspension of the rules and passage of the resolution.

Mr. Cunningham demanded a yea and nay vote.

The rules were suspended, and the resolution was adopted, yeas, 145; nays, 0.

YEAS.

Messrs. President,

Carmichael (Colbert),

Altman,

Carmichael (Coffee),

Ashcraft,

Carnathon,

Banks,

Case,

Barefield,

Chapman,

Bartlett,

Cobb,

Beavers,

Cofer,

Beddow,

Coleman (Greene),

Bethune,

Coleman (Walker),

Blackwell,

Cornwell,

Boone,

Craig,

Brooks,

Cunningham,

Browne,

Davis (DeKalb),

Bulger,

Davis (Etowah),

Burnett,

Dent,

Burns,

Duke,

Byars,

Espy,

Cardon,

Eyster,


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CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

Ferguson,

McMillan (Baldwin),

Fitts,

McMillan (Wilcox),

Fletcher,

Malone,

Foshee,

Martin,

Foster,

Maxwell,

Freeman,

Merrill,

Gilmore,

Miller (Marengo),

Glover,

Miller (Wilcox),

Graham (Montgomery),

Moody,

Graham (Talladega),

Morrisette,

Grant,

Mulkey,

Grayson,

Murphree,

Greer (Calhoun),

NeSmith,

Greer (Perry),

Norman,

Haley,

Norwood,

Handley,

Oates,

Harrison,

O’Neal (Lauderdale),

Heflin (Chambers),

O’Nei1 (Jefferson),

Heflin (Randolph),

Opp,

Henderson,

O’Rear,

Hinson,

Palmer,

Hodges,

Parker (Cullman),

Hood,

Parker (Elmore),

Howell,

Pearce,

Howze,

Pettus,

Inge,

Phillips,

Jackson,

Pillans,

Jenkins,

Pitts,

Jones (Bibb),

Porter,

Jones (Hale),

Proctor,

Jones (Montgomery),

Reese,

Jones (Wilcox),

Renfro,

Kirk,

Reynolds (Chilton),

Kirkland,

Reynolds (Henry),

Knight,

Robinson,

Ledbetter,

Rogers (Lowndes),

Leigh,

Rogers (Sumter),

Locklin,

Samford,

Lomax,

Sanders,

Long (Butler),

Sanford,

Long (Walker),

Searcy,


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Selheimer,

Vaughan,

Sentell,

Waddell,

Sloan,

Walker,

Smith (Mobile),

Watts,

Smith, Mac. A.,

Weakley,

Smith, Morgan M.,

Weatherly,

Sollie,

White,

Sorrel1,

Whiteside,

Spears,

Williams (Marengo),

Spragins,

Williams (Elmore),

Stewart,

Wilson (Clarke),

Studdard,

Wilson (Washington),

Tayloe,

Winn.

Thompson,

Mr. Harrison offered the following resolution:

Resolved, That when this Convention adjourn to-day it adjourn to meet at 12 o’clock on Monday next.

Mr. Harrison moved that the rules be suspended and that the resolution be put on its immediate passage.

Mr. Cunningham raised the point of order that the resolution was a privileged resolution, and did not require a suspension of the rules.

The Chair sustained the point of order, and the resolution was adopted.

PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR.

Mr. Oates moved that the privileges of the floor be extended to the Hon. E.W. Pettus.

Mr. O’Neil, of Jefferson, moved to amend the motion of Mr. Oates by including the Hon. John T. Morgan.

The amendment was accepted, and the motion was unanimously adopted.

RESOLUTIONS

Mr. Pettus offered the following resolution:

Be it resolved, That in its action this Convention shall adhere and be governed by the act of the General Assembly, approved December 11, 1900, providing for


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CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

the holding of this Convention.

The resolution was referred to the Committee on Rules.

REPORT OF SPECIAL COMMITTEE.

Your committee to inquire into the desirability, practicability and probable cost of obtaining a full and accurate stenographic report of the proceedings of this Convention, make the following report:

We called before us the stenographers applying for the contract, and received from them such information touching said work as was obtainable.

Mr. McGauly submitted the following proposition, to-wit:

Montgomery, Ala., May 21, 1901.

Alabama Constitutional Convention, Montgomery, Ala.

Gentlemen-I would respectfully submit the following proposition:

I will undertake to furnish an accurate verbatim stenographic report of each day’s proceedings of the Constitutional Convention, and deliver one thousand (1,000) printed copies thereof, to the Secretary of the Convention by 9 o=clock on the morning of each days succeeding that on which such proceedings were had, for the sum of seventy dollars ($ 70.00) per diem, for whatever number of days the Convention may remain in session. Should the Convention not convene on any day, i. e., Sundays and recess days, no per diem charge to be made.

In consideration of the per diem compensation quoted above, I will undertake to associate with me a sufficient number of skilled and experienced stenographers, men in every way competent to perform this class of work, who will act in relays-succeeding each other at short intervals throughout the session; (2) a staff of type-writers to whom the stenographers will dictate their notes; (3) reliable and responsible printers with ample


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

facilities to print and furnish 1,000 copies of the proceedings each morning by 9 o’clock.

Very respectfully,

PAT MCGAULY.

Messrs. Hoffman & May submitted the following proposition, to-wit:

Montgomery, Ala., May 23, 1901.

To the Committee having in charge the question of stenographical reporting of the proceedings of the Convention, etc.

Gentlemen of the Committee-We beg to submit for your consideration two plans upon which we propose to report the proceedings.

We are informed by the Advertiser that he will print daily, in a separate supplement to his newspaper, the full proceedings of the day before for the sum of $25 per day, and we are authorized to make the proposition to this committee as coming from him. He will furnish to the Convention for this sum 200 copies of the supplement free of charge.

If it is desired to have this done, we will begin delivering copy to him at 1 o’clock each day, and thereafter, with sufficient rapidity, copy will be delivered to him to keep the printers busy and enable them to have the same printed in the morning paper. We will do this for $2,500 for the first thirty working days of the Convention. Should the session of the Convention extend beyond that time, we will perform the same work during the additional time over thirty days for the sum of $425 per week or fraction thereof.

Should it not be desired to print these proceedings daily as above outlined, we will report the proceedings and lay on the table of the Secretary each morning a complete and accurate report of the previous day’s session for $2,250.00 for the first thirty working days of the session, and $350 per week or fraction thereof in excess of that time.

As there are others seeking this contract, and as the work will not be of any service to the Convention or


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CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

State unless absolutely accurate, we are willing to submit to the following test: Let our corps of reporters and the corps of any other applicant or applicants take the proceedings on any day named by the committee, and then let the committee order both corps to transcribe the proceedings, or to come before the committee and read from shorthand whatever may be desired and let the contract be awarded the corps showing the greatest facility in reading or making the best transcript, as the case may be.

We wish to assure the committee that we have a corps of reporters whose ability to do this work cannot be questioned, and we are so well satisfied ourselves on this point that we will gladly submit to the severe test of ability above proposed, if it is required.

We are ready to name our corps of reporters to the committee, and would suggest the advisability of having other applicants do the same, that the committee may judge as to whether any particular corps can or cannot do the work in a satisfactory manner.

If either of these propositions is accepted, we request the committee to recommend the appointment of F.O. Hoffman of Mobile and E. L. May of Montgomery, jointly, as the official stenographers of this Convention.

Respectfully submitted,

FRANCIS O. HOFFMAN,

E. L. MAY.

The last proposition, including the printing, would amount in the aggregate to $3,100.00 per month of twenty-six working days, or for thirty days as set forth therein.

The proposition of Mr. McGauly for the same length of time, or twenty-six days, would cost $1,820.00.

No test was made by the committee as to the capacity and efficiency of the bidders, as we had no opportunity in our limited time, but presuming that each of them were capable, and to fix their responsibility for doing the work accurately, we recommend that the successful bidder be required to give a bond, payable to the State of Alabama, to be approved by the President of this


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

Convention, in the sum of $1,500.00, and conditioned that he perform his duties gas such reporter, according to the terms of his contract.

Your committee recommend a, full and complete report of the proceedings of this Convention, and its Mr. McGauly’s proposition incurs much less expense to the State than that of Messrs. Hoffman & May, the committee recommend that it be accepted by the Convention.

Should the aforesaid report be adopted by the Convention, your committee recommends the adoption the following resolution:

Resolved, That the President of this Convention be, and he is hereby authorized to enter into a contract with Mr. Pat McGauly to furnish daily a correct and full stenographic report of the proceedings of this Convention, and to require him to enter into bond with good surety in the penal sum of $1,000,00, payable to the State of Alabama, for the faithful performance of this contract. And any substantial failure on the part of said McGauly to comply with his said contract shall be deemed a breach of said bond.

Your committee asks the adoption of this report, and that they be discharged.

WM. C. OATES.

MINORITY REPORT.

Mr. Ashcraft, of the special committee, offered the following minority report:

Mr. President, and Gentlemen of the Convention: The undersigned, member of the special committee appointed to consider the propriety and expense of a stenographic report of all the proceedings of this Convention, feels constrained to dissent from the opinion of the majority, and begs leave to submit the following minority report:

The Journals of this Convention will contain a full record of all its official proceedings. The stenographic report will contain, in addition to these proceedings, a full report of all speeches and debates. The majority


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CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

claimed three advantages for a report of these speeches, and debates:

First-It is claimed that they will throw great light in the future, upon the true interpretation of the Constitution. I can not concur in this view. We and those who are to come after us, will yet be wiser than we are now. We will write a new Constitution with patriotic purposes, based upon the highest reasons within our grasp, and make the noblest uses of it we can. Hereafter the same patriotism, in the light of new and happier experiences, will find higher reasons for our action, and nobler uses for our work. When this work is tested before the Supreme Court of the United States, we do not want that body to search for light amid the impassioned darkness of the debates on the Fourteenth and Fifteenth Amendments. Nor will we want it judged by the bitterness which the sense of our ever pressing injury will be sure to infect our debates. We are going to approach right conclusions, but we will sometimes be driven from the straight course by the irresistible storm.

Second-It is claimed by the majority that the publication of the speeches and debates will be of great value in educating our people to the needs of a new Constitution and the reasons for the particular form it shall take. I do not believe it will possess this value. The press of this State is in favor of this movement, and, if we give good reasons for our course, those reasons will be promulgated and given the widest circulation by our patriotic editors. If we give bad reasons, they will be charitably censored, and the evil influence restrained. Again, the great questions before the Convention will be chiefly determined before the committees, and it is urged by some that the main question we are here to determine should be considered in executive session. While I do not commit myself to this proposition, I mention it to show the anxiety felt as to the nature of the arguments which may be advanced.

Third-The majority claim that a knowledge of the fact that every word is to be recorded will lend dignity and solemnity to the discussions. This does not com-


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

port with my limited observations of men. If there are any who are rash or lightminded, they are, of all persons, least conscious of that fact, and lightly rush in, while those who are conservative and conscious of the weight of responsibility, hesitate. I believe this full report will repress discussion by this latter class, and will increase it by the former class; if any such are members of this Convention.

While I am satisfied that the arrangement planned by the committee is the most advantageous which can be had, I do not believe the proposed investment is the best use that can be, made of the money for the good of the people.

With the profoundest regret, I am, for the reasons briefly stated above, compelled to differ from the able and patriotic gentlemen who compose the majority, and to report that I do not believe it is expedient for this Convention to cause a stenographic report of its proceedings to be made, and to incur the expense thereof.

JOHN T. ASHCRAFT,

Member of the Committee.

Mr. Ashcraft moved to substitute the minority report for the majority report.

Mr. Cobb moved that the further consideration of the report of the committee go over until Monday, and that it be made a special order, on that day immediately after the reading of the Journal.

The motion was lost.

Mr. Oates demanded the previous question on the motion of Mr. Ashcraft to substitute the minority report for the majority report.

The ayes and nays were demanded.

The motion was lost, yeas, 60; nays, 80.

YEAS.

Messrs. Ashcraft,

Bulger,

Barefield,

Burns,

Beavers,

Byars,

Beddow,

Carmichael (Colbert),

Boone,

Carnathon,


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CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

Case,

McMillan (Wilcox),

Chapman,

Malone,

Cobb,

Maxwell,

Cofer,

Miller (Marengo),

Coleman (Greene),

Moody,

Coleman (Walker),

Mulkey,

Davis (DeKalb),

Norwood,

Duke,

Opp,

Fitts,

Parker (Elmore),

Fletcher,

Pearce,

Glover,

Pettus,

Grayson,

Phillips,

Haley,

Proctor,

Heflin (Chambers),

Reynolds (Henry),

Heflin (Randolph),

Robinson,

Hodges,

Rogers (Lowndes),

Howze,

Samford,

Inge,

Smith, Mac. A.,

Jackson,

Smith, Morgan M.,

Kirk,

Sorrell,

Kirkland,

Spragins,

Ledbetter,

Walker,

Locklin,

Weakley,

Long (Butler),

Williams (Marengo),

Long (Walker),

Wilson (Clarke),

NAYS.

Messrs. President,

Dent,

Altman,

Espy,

Banks,

Ferguson,

Bethune,

Foshee,

Blackwell,

Foster,

Brooks,

Freeman,

Browne,

Gilmore,

Burnett,

Graham (Montgomery),

Cardon,

Graham (Talladega),

Carmichael (Coffee),

Grant,

Cornwell,

Greer (Calhoun),

Cunningham,

Greer (Perry),

Davis (Etowah),

Handley,


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

Harrison,

Parker (Cullman),

Henderson,

Pillans,

Hinson,

Mitts,

Hood,

Porter,

Howell,

Renfro,

Jenkins,

Reynolds (Chilton),

Jones (Bibb),

Rogers (Sumter),

Jones (Hale),

Sanders,

Jones (Montgomery),

Sanford,

Jones (Wilcox),

Searcy,

Knight,

Selheimer,

Merrill,

Sentell,

Lomax,

Sloan,

Lowe (Jefferson),

Smith (Mobile),

McMillan (Baldwin),

Sollie,

Martin,

Spears,

Merrill,

Stewart,

Miller (Wilcox),

Studdard,

Morrisette,

Thompson,

Murphree,

Vaughan,

NeSmith,

Waddell,

Norman,

Watt,

Oates,

Weatherly,

O’Neal (Lauderdale),

White,

O’Neill (Jefferson),

Whiteside,

O’Rear,

Wilson (Washington),

Palmer,

Winn.

CHANGE OF VOTE.

Mr. Greer, of Calhoun, changed his vote from aye to no for the purpose of moving a reconsideration of the vote.

PAIRS ANNOUNCED.

Mr. Eyster announced that he was paired with the delegate from Perry, Mr. Tayloe, if Mr. Tayloe was present he would vote aye, and Mr. Eyster would vote no.


51

CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

RECONSIDERATION OF VOTE.

Mr. Browne moved to reconsider the vote by which the minority report was lost, and to lay that motion on the table.

The motion prevailed.

ADOPTION OF MAJORITY REPORT.

Mr. Oates moved that the majority report of the special committee be adopted, and the motion prevailed.

Mr. Long, of Walker, offered a substitute for the majority report. The substitute was ruled out of order.

RESOLUTIONS.

Mr. Eyster offered the following resolution, by request:

Resolved, That in order to test the accuracy of any report that may be made of the proceedings of this Convention, the following tests shall be had:

1. That said reporter or reporters who may be employed to do this work, shall be required on tomorrow morning to furnish a transcript of the proceedings this day had, or such other day as the Convention shall require, and the reporter or reporters furnishing the best transcript shall be awarded the work.

2. That said reporter or reporters shall be called upon to refill their notes on the floor of the Convention when occasion requires, and the reporter or reporters reading their notes most fluently and satisfactorily shall be awarded the work.

3. That the Rules Committee, when said Convention is not in session, shall call said reporters before them and request a reading of any part of their notes, and those reporters reading them most satisfactory shall be awarded the work.

Resolved further, that the Rules Committee may adopt any other mode of testing this question that they may see fit.

Resolved further, that no steps shall be taken to make permanent arrangements with regard to this work until some one of the above tests have been made.


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JOURNAL OF ALABAMA

Resolved further, that the price shall meet with the approval of the Convention before any work of this character shall be authorized.

Mr. Sanford raised the point of order that the resolution was out of order, in that the majority report of the committee, which had been adopted, authorized a contract with a competent stenographer therein carried, thereby rendering a test unnecessary.

The point of order was sustained, and the resolution was ruled out of order.

ADJOURNMENT.

On motion of Mr. Long, of Butler, the Convention adjourned until 12 o’clock m. Monday.