May 27th, 1901.
The Convention was called to order by the President and was opened with prayer by the Rev. Dr. Anderson.
The roll was called and showed 121 members present.
Leaves of absence for today were granted to Messrs. Ledbetter, Sanders, Greer, Ashcraft.
Leaves of absence for today and tomorrow were granted Messrs. Long (Walker), Locklin, Hale, Coleman.
Leave of absence was granted for three days to Messrs. Renfro and General Harrison, the leave to the latter gentleman being to allow him to attend the Confederate Reunion at Memphis, he being at the head of the Confederate Veterans Association.
MR. GRAHAM--I move that in the reading of the journal, that portion of it which includes the propositions as to the stenographic report be omitted as it is unnecessary.
The motion was carried.
MR. PETTUS--I move that the entire reading of the journal be dispensed with and that the same be referred to the Committee on Journal when it is created.
The motion was carried.
Mr. Wilson (Clarke) here took the chair.
MR. KNOX--The Committee on Rules begs leave to submit a report covering the rules which are recommended for the adoption of this Convention.
The report was read as follows:
Rule I--The President shall take the chair every day at the hour fixed on the preceding adjournment; shall immediately call the delegates to order, and proceed with the regular order of business.
Rule 2--He shall preserve order and decorum; may speak to points of order in preference to other delegates, rising from his chair for that purpose. He shall decide questions of order, subject to an appeal to the Convention, at the request of any delegate; which appeal shall be decided without debate, except that the delegate taking the appeal, or any other delegate to whom he may yield, may speak to the appeal not exceeding five minutes. An appeal shall not be put to the Convention unless it is seconded.
Rule 3--He shall rise to put a question, but may state it sitting. All questions shall be distinctly put in this form, viz : "Those in favor of (as the question may be) say aye," and after the affirmative vote is expressed "those opposed to the motion say no." If the President doubts, or a division is called for before a decision is announced, they shall divide. Those in the affirmative of the question shall rise from their seats; and afterwards those in the negative. The President shall then state the decision of the Convention.
Rule 4--He shall have a right to name any delegate to perform the duties of the Chair, but such substitution shall not extend beyond an adjournment.
Rule 5--The President shall, whenever he deems it necessary for the speedy dispatch of business, order the calendar printed for the use of delegates.
Rule 6--All ordinances which have been finally acted upon by the Convention shall be signed by the President, and all other
acts of the Convention, except resolutions, which it may become necessary to reduce to writing, shall be evidenced by the signature of the President, attested by the Secretary.
Rule 7--All officers and employees appointed or elected by the Convention shall hold their offices at the pleasure of the Convention only, and the clerks of committees at the pleasure of the committee for which they were appointed.
Rule 8--The Secretary shall keep a correct journal of the proceedings of the Convention in a well bound book, to be provided for that purpose, and shall read the same daily to the Convention if required. He shall be responsible to the Convention for the accuracy of the journal and for the faithful and prompt execution of the work ordered by the Convention. He shall endorse all resolutions and orders proper to be endorsed; he shall keep in his charge all documents in the custody of the Convention and keep them in order, and shall perform such other duties as may be required by the Convention.
Rule 9--The Secretary shall keep a register of ordinances, which shall show the title of each ordinance in the order in which it was introduced, and the several actions of the Convention shall be noted with the date of the action immediately below the title. He shall keep an index to the register arranged according to the names of the delegates and also the subject matter of the ordinances.
Rule 10--The door-keeper shall perform the duties of Sergeant-at-Arms. He shall execute the orders of the President and of the Convention. He shall keep in order the hall. He shall keep the door of the hall and perform such other duties as may be required of him.
Rule 11--When any delegate is about to speak or deliver any matter to the Convention, he shall rise from his seat and respectfully address himself to the President.
Rule 12--If any delegate transgress the rules of this Convention, the President shall, or any delegate may, call him to order; in which case the delegate so called to order, if speaking, shall immediately sit down, unless permitted to explain. The point of order raised shall be stated when a delegate is called to order, and decided by the President, and the Convention shall, if appealed to, decide on the case, but without debate. If the decision be in favor of the delegate called to order he shall be at liberty to proceed; if the decision be against him and he refuses to obey, the President may direct the Sergeant-at-Arms to seat him or remove him from the floor of the Convention and he may be liable to the censure of the Convention.
Rule 13--When two or more delegates happen to rise at the same time, the President shall name the person who is first to speak.
Rule 14--No delegate shall speak more than once to the same question, nor more than half an hour at any time, without leave of the Convention, unless he be the mover or Chairman of the Committee proposing the matter pending, in which case he shall be permitted to speak in reply, but not until every delegate choosing to speak shall have spoken.
Rule 15--While the President is putting any question or addressing the Convention, no person shall walk out of or across the hall of the Convention; nor in such case, or when a delegate is speaking, shall entertain private discourse, nor while a delegate is speaking shall pass between him and the Chair. Every delegate shall remain uncovered during the session of the Convention. No delegate or other person shall visit or remain by the Secretary's table while the yeas and nays are being called or ballots are being counted.
Rule 16--Delegates shall particularly forbear personal reflections; nor shall any delegate name another in argument or debate.
Rule 17--The previous question shall be in the following form "Shall the main question be now put?" If demanded by a vote of a majority of the delegates present, its effect shall be to cut off all debate and bring the Convention to a direct vote, but the mover of the question, or the Chairman of the Committee having charge of the bill or resolution, shall have the right to close the debate, after the call of the previous question has been sustained, for not more than thirty minutes, unless the Convention extends the time. The demand for the previous question may be limited by the mover to, any subsidiary motion or motions not of a higher rank than the motion for the previous question, or made to apply to the main question and all subsidiary motions.
Rule 18--On a previous question there shall be no debate. All incidental questions of order arising after a motion is made for the previous question, and pending such motion shall be decided, whether on appeal or otherwise, without debate.
Rule 19--No person shall be allowed to smoke within the House, lobby or gallery.
Rule 20--No applause shall be permitted either on the floor or in the gallery of the Convention.
Rule 21--In case of any disturbance or disorderly conduct in the lobby or gallery the President shall have the power to order the same to be cleared.
Rule 22--The following shall be the order of business in the Convention
1. Call to order.
3. Ascertainment of quorum.
4. Report of Committee on Journal.
5. Approval of Journal.
6. Call of the roll in alphabetical order for the introduction of resolutions, memorials, petitions and ordinances and their proper reference.
7. Reports of standing committees.
8. Reports of special committees.
9. Unfinished business.
10. Special orders.
11. Consideration of ordinances and resolutions which have been reported from committees.
If the call of the roll for the introduction of resolutions, etc., is not completed on any day, it shall be resumed on the next day where left off on the preceding day. This provision shall also apply to reports of standing committees.
Motions--Stated or read; when to be in writing.
Rule 23--When a motion is made, it shall be stated by the President; or if in writing, shall be read aloud by the Secretary; and every motion shall be reduced to writing if the President or any delegate request it.
Rule 24--After a motion is stated by the President, or read by the Secretary, it shall be deemed in the possession of the Convention, but may be withdrawn by leave of the Convention, at any time before decision.
Rule 25--When a question is before the convention, motions may be received in the following order, to wit: 1st. To fix the time to which the Convention shall adjourn. 2nd. To adjourn. 3rd. To lay on the table. 4th. For the previous question. 5th. To postpone to a certain day, not beyond the probable duration of the session. 6th. To commit. 7th. To amend. 8th. To indefinitely postpone.
Which several motions shall have precedence in the order in which they are arranged; and no motion to postpone to a day certain, to commit, or to postpone indefinitely, being decided, shall be again allowed on the same day and at the same stage of the motion or proposition.
Rule 26--A motion to adjourn shall always be in order, even in the absence of a quorum, except when on the call for the previous question, the main question shall have been ordered, or when the Chair is stating a question, or when the roll is being called or has been called, and the vote has not been announced, or when a vote is being verified, or when a member has the floor; and such motion shall be decided without debate.
Rule 27--When a vote has passed, except on the previous question, or on motion to lay on the table, or to take from the table, it shall be in order for any delegate who voted with the majority to move for a reconsideration thereof on the same day, or within the morning session of the succeeding day, and such motion, if made on the same day, shall be considered on the next succeeding day immediately after the approval of the journal; but if first moved on such succeeding day, it shall be forthwith considered; and when a motion for reconsideration is decided, that decision shall not be reconsidered, and no question shall be twice reconsidered. A motion to reconsider a vote, upon any incidental or subsidiary question, shall not remove the main subject under consideration from the house, but shall be considered at the time when it is made.
Rule 28--All resolutions before they are voted on shall be referred to and reported from the Committee on Rules.
Rule 29--When motions are made for the reference of a subject to a select committee and a standing committee, the question for the reference to a standing committee shall be first put.
Rule 30--Any matter may, by a vote of the majority of the delegates present, be made the special order for any hour, which shall take precedence, at that hour, of any other business except a motion to reconsider.
Rule 31--Motions to fill blanks shall be considered and treated as other amendments.
Rule 32--A motion to table shall carry to the table only the amendment, question or questions to which it is addressed.
Rule 33--Twenty-five delegates shall have power to send for absent delegates or to move a call of the house; but no call of the house shall be made except on the concurrence of a majority of the delegates present. A majority of the convention shall be a quorum to transact business.
Rule 34--Upon the call of the convention for taking the ayes and noes on any question, the name of the President shall be first called, and the names of the delegates shall be called alphabetically, and each delegate shall answer from his seat.
Rule 35--When any question is taken by ayes and noes, and a delegate who has been absent returns before the question is decided, he shall be privileged to make inquiry of the subject before the convention, and record his vote without discussion.
Rule 36--The ayes and noes shall only be ordered when the call therefor is sustained by thirty delegates.
Rule 37--Any delegate may call for a division of the question when the sense will admit of it.
Rule 38--Every delegate may be required to vote on any question before the convention. When the ayes and noes are ordered, the President shall be first called, and if the convention be equally divided, the question shall be lost.
Rule 39--No delegate shall absent himself from the session of the convention, unless he have leave, be sick, or unable to attend.
Rule 40--After a vote has been ordered upon any question, no delegate shall be permitted to explain his vote without the unanimous consent of the convention.
By Whom Committees Appointed; Quorum; Standing Committees.
Rule 41--The President shall appoint all committees unless otherwise directed by the convention. A majority shall constitute a quorum. The following shall constitute the standing committees of the convention
(1) Rules, of which the President shall be chairman, to be composed of nine members, and which shall have the right to report at any time.
(2) Judiciary, to be composed of twenty-five members.
(3) Order, Consistency and Harmony of the Constitution, to be composed of twenty-five members.
(4) Suffrage and Elections, to be composed of twenty-five members.
(5) Legislative Department, to be composed of nineteen members.
(6) Local Legislation, to be composed of nineteen members.
(7) Education, to be composed of nineteen members.
(8) Taxation, to be composed of nineteen members.
(9) Executive Department, to be composed of fifteen members.
(10) Preamble and Declaration of Rights, to be composed of fifteen members.
(11) Corporations, to be composed of fifteen members.
(12) Representation, to be composed of fifteen members.
(13) Exemption, to be composed of fifteen members.
(14) Militia, to be composed of fifteen members.
(15) Banks and Banking, to be composed of fifteen members.
(16) Municipal Corporations, to be composed of fifteen members.
(17) State and County Boundaries, to be composed of fifteen members.
(18) Impeachment, to be composed of fifteen members.
(19) Amending the Constitution and Miscellaneous Provisions, composed of fifteen members.
(20) Journal, to be composed of five members.
(21) Schedules, Printing and Incidental Expenses, to be composed of nine members.
Rule 42--The following committees shall be entitled to clerks to be appointed by the respective chairmen of the committees, whenever in the discretion of the chairman of either of said committees it may be necessary: Rules, Judiciary, Order, Consistency and Harmony of the Constitution, Suffrage and Elections, Education and Corporations.
Rule 43--Any ordinance or resolution may be recalled from a committee by a vote of the majority of the whole number of delegates elected to the convention.
Rule 44--No committee shall sit during the sitting of the convention without special leave.
Rule 45--The President shall designate who shall be the chairmen of all committees appointed.
Rule 46--When the chairman of a committee is sick, or unable to perform his duties, or absent from the city, the delegate whose name appears second on the committee shall, during the sickness, inability or absence of the chairman, become chairman, and have power to call together the committee for consideration of business.
Introduction, Reference and Printing of Ordinances.
Rule 47--When any ordinance is introduced it shall be read at length and be referred by the President without a vote being taken, unless otherwise ordered by a two-thirds vote of the convention, to the appropriate committee. No ordinance shall be reported back from any committee until after the lapse of one entire legislative day. When any committee shall have reported to this convention any article or section of the proposed constitution, said
article or section shall again be read at length and three hundred copies thereof printed for the use of delegates; and such article or section shall lie on the table at least one day and until in regular order it shall be taken up for consideration by the convention.
Rule 48--Ordinances and reports may be recommitted at the pleasure of the Convention.
Rule 49--Upon the final adoption of any article or section of the Constitution the vote shall be taken by yeas and nays and spread upon the Journal and the article as adopted shall be spread upon the Journal and be referred to the Committee on Order, Consistency and Harmony of the Constitution.
Rule 50--The title of each ordinance
shall state concisely its subject matter, and shall state the
article and section of the present Constitution to which it relates
as far as practicable. Each ordinance shall be written on an entire
sheet of paper with the name of the delegate who introduces it
and the title of the ordinance
Rule 51--When an ordinance or article is reported to the Convention and a minority report accompanies the majority report, the ordinance or article accompanying the minority report shall be considered an amendment, and the same shall be printed and the ordinance or article shall be read a second time; and said ordinance or article and minority report shall be placed on the calendar and be considered on the third reading of the ordinance or article.
Rule 52--All articles of the Constitution after their adoption by the Convention shall be engrossed before their delivery to the Committee on Order, Consistency and Harmony of the Constitution and after the report of said Committee has been adopted by the Convention said Constitution shall be correctly enrolled.
Rule 53--The Committee on Order, Consistency and Harmony of the Constitution shall report the entire proposed Constitution to the Convention, and the Constitution so reported shall be read and acted upon, article by article and section by section, and submitted to a vote of the Convention: if a majority of the members present shall vote therefor the same shall be adopted, but if amended in any particular it shall be re-referred with such amendments to the said committee, who shall cause the Constitution with the amendments so adopted to be re-written and report the same to the Convention for its action. When the Constitution shall have been finally adopted by the Convention it shall be enrolled, and when enrolled it shall be again read and attested by the President and Secretary, and each delegate to the Convention personally shall sign his name thereto. The signature of a majority of the delegates present, if a majority of the Convention, shall constitute a sufficient attestation.
Rule 54--All propositions intended to be incorporated in the Constitution to be formed when herein referred to are designated as ordinances and other propositions submitted to the Convention when herein referred to are designated as resolutions.
Rule 55--That the rules of the Convention shall be suspended, except by a two-thirds vote of every delegate present, provided a quorum must vote.
Rule 56--The lobby or floor of the Convention shall be kept clear of all persons who are not entitled to the freedom thereof; and the persons entitled to such freedom of the hall shall be as follows, viz : (1) Delegates and officers of the Convention; (2) Clerks of the Committees of the Convention; (3) Bona fide representatives of the press.
Rule 57--None of the foregoing rules shall be rescinded, without one day's notice of the motion thereof being given; and a violation of either of them may be punished by such censure as a majority of the Convention may direct.
MR. KNOX--I move the adoption of the report of the Committee on Rules.
GOVERNOR OATES--Before that motion is put, I will ask for the reading of either the third or the fourth rule again. It refers to a demand for a division. I do not know that I understood it correctly.
Rule 3, as above, was read by the Clerk.
GOVERNOR OATES--I submit to the gentlemen supporting the rules, that no one can properly demand a division by rising until the Chair announces the vote. They cannot demand it before. It ought to be required that just as soon as it is announced if there is any one desiring a division, he shall demand it at once. That is in accord with universal custom. When a vote is taken, if any delegate wishes to demand a division, the demand for the division is only a doubt as to the correctness of the decision as announced by the Chair. For instance, the Chair says, "As many as are in favor of the proposition will say yea and those opposed nay" and if there is a decision, as I understood the rule, it is then too late to demand a division by rising. Now, no demand can be made for a division until the Chair does announce the vote. I may be mistaken, but that is the way I understood it.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.--The present occupant of the Chair understands it as does the gentleman from Montgomery, that a division must be called for before the result of the viva voce vote is announced.
MR. KNOX--Not before the vote is announced but before the decision.
GOVERNOR OATES--I do not understand the distinction. The Chair announced the vote, which is the decision.
MR. BURNETT--If I understand the gentleman from Montgomery, he is endeavoring to make the point that after the decision is announced where the vote is close, each delegate on the opposing side will have a reasonable right to presume that the decision will be in his favor and he has nothing on which to call for a division until it is announced and then under this rule it is too late. Would it not be better to allow the right to call for the decision after the vote is announced?
GOVERNOR OATES--That is exactly what I am trying to say. I do not think the rule gives that right, and I respectfully ask the Committee to make that correction.
MR. LOMAX--I will state to my friend from Montgomery that the idea of the Committee was this, that upon the vote being
taken the President would announce "the ayes seem to have it" or "in the opinion of the Chair the ayes have it," and that then a division could be called for but that after the final decision of the Chair "The ayes have it," the demand for a division is too late.
GOVERNOR OATES--I will say in reply, that I presume that is what the Committee intended but I think the language is susceptible of a different construction. It ought to be just that way, and if that is the meaning of it, it is all right.
MR. KNOX--That is the meaning the Committee intended it should have, that after the vote was announced "ayes 41 and noes 51," it would not be considered that the result had been announced and any gentleman could rise and demand a division, but after the Chair said "The ayes have it, or "The noes have it," it would be too late.
GOVERNOR OATES--The point I was driving at was not so much about calling the yeas and nays, I did not refer to that, but if the rule means that after the Chair announces so many ayes and so many noes, that then the opportunity should be extended to call for a division. That is the time if any gentleman wants a division to demand it. That is all the point I was making, and if that is the meaning of the rule as announced by the committee, I think it is all right.
MR. KNOX--That is the way we understand the rule.
MR. BULGER--I am not clear that I understand rule 32 and I would ask that it be read.
The rule was read as follows: "A motion to table shall carry to the table only the amendment, question or questions to which it is addressed."
MR. BULGER--I would ask the chairman of the committee a question: I understand there is a distinction in parliamentary law between an amendment and a substitute and I would ask the chairman of the committee if it is the intention of the rule that it shall not only apply to an amendment, but also to a substitute offered.
MR. KNOX--The Chairman of the Committee is of opinion that it would apply to an amendment or substitute and the rule says "an amendment, question or questions to which it is addressed."
MR. BULGER--Then I understand a motion to table a substitute, if carried, under that rule will not carry the original proposition to the table?
MR. KNOX--It is the object of this rule to prevent that.
MR. BULGER--I am not clear that I understand Rule 27, and I ask that that be read.
Rule 27 was read.
MR. BULGER--I would like to ask the Chairman of the Committee if a motion is made to reconsider today, can that motion be passed upon today under that rule or will it go over and be passed upon during the morning session tomorrow? Does it of necessity go over until tomorrow?
MR. KNOX--In the opinion of the Chairman of the Committee it would go over until the next day.
GOVERNOR OATES--There is nothing
which contributes more to the facility of proceeding of a body
like this than having rules, and good rules, rules which are understood
by the members. So far as I could hear the reading of the rules
they are very good and I do not know that there are any valid
objections to be made to any of them, if so, they are very few,
but nothing as I stated will so much eliminate useless debate
and unnecessary contention as rules which are understood and which
are easy of interpretation. To that end, and not with a view of
delaying, but because I think it will be a saving of time, I would
respectfully ask the committee and the convention that these rules
be printed and go over until tomorrow so as to give every delegate
an opportunity of reading them and seeing what they are and so
that afterwards no delegate can rise on this floor and say he
did not understand the rules, for he will have had a fair opportunity
understand just what they are. I make that motion.
MR. KNOX--Mr. President, the Committee on Rules have devoted several days to studying this question. They have examined the rules adopted in the Constitutional Convention of Louisiana, of Mississippi and of South Carolina, and the rules of the former House of Representatives of this State, and we think we have selected with great care those rules that will be best adapted to the purposes of this convention. There are a great many important questions arising constantly, and governed as we have been for several days by general parliamentary law, it is exceedingly difficult to reach correct conclusions, as authorities differ so widely as to what does constitute general parliamentary law. It seems to me that the business of the convention would be advanced by adopting these rules at this session, and not by a postponement. I therefore oppose the motion of the gentleman to indefinitely postpone consideration.
MR. MACDONALD--It seems to me that the result suggested by the gentleman from Montgomery could be obtained very easily by having these rules printed. For the rules to be adopted as reported and ordered printed.
MR. KNOX--It is my purpose to move to print immediately after adoption.
MR. MACDONALD--Very good.
THE PRESIDENT, PRO TEM.--The Chairman of the Committee moved the adoption of the rules, and the gentleman from Montgomery moved an indefinite postponement.
MR. HARRISON--In addition to what has been said by the Chairman of the Committee I desire to add that this committee after a laborious session of several days felt that it was our duty after examining closely all the rules referred to by the chairman have made this report. It may riot be perfect, but we have heard very few objections and it occurs to me that in half an hour here, if the gentlemen desire to amend these rules, it can be done, and have them explained in detail. If we postpone these rules as they provide for the appointment of committees, it delays the entire convention either until tomorrow, or until they are considered. Our organization is not complete. Committees cannot be appointed, and the Convention necessarily cannot work. If we find any hardship or anything wrong with them, we have a right to change them. It is in order to enable the Convention to commence the work devolving upon it, that I trust that if there are objections, they will be pointed out now, at this session, and that the rules will be adopted today, so that the organization of the Convention can be completed and the Convention really go to work on tomorrow.
MR. PILLANS--I feel the greatest confidence in the sagacity, patriotism and prudence of the gentlemen who constituted the Committee on Rules, who have spent more time than I and few other gentlemen have spent on this question, but the suggestion which is made shows the force of the motion of the gentleman from Montgomery to substitute and the reason for it. It is suggested by the gentleman from Lee that we will lose time by postponing. I think that I can show that we will not. It is suggested by him that to save time we should pass the rules as they have been presented, after such amendments are made as this body shall deem to be requisite, if any are made which meet the approbation of the body, and therefore all such suggestions should be made now, debated now and the rules, as then amended, adopted. Well I confess that I was unable throughout the reading of these rules, thoroughly to understand and appreciate all of them, and the questions that have been asked indicate that other gentlemen more sagacious than I, have met with the same difficulty. It is very possible that if the rules be printed and they go over until tomorrow, it will be found that there are no objections to them, but the adoption of the rules of this body means the adoption of a system of government which cannot be changed after we are started, unless so onerous in some particular that a majority of the members want it changed and sustain a motion to that effect. Is not it better therefore to know what we are doing before we do it? Is not it better that the code of rules be known to the members before we
vote for them. Is it not better that not only should the gentlemen who have been very diligently and ably working at the rules should know what is in the rules but all the other members should know.
Now I will state what occurred to me when the rules were read. It occurred to me that there was some embarrassment in one or two of the most material rules and that is the reason that I suggested, if I might say so, to my friend from Montgomery, to make the motion, when he asked the question. It occurred to me, sir, that there might be some considerable embarrassment in the framing or caption of ordinances. I know that the rules of the Committee did not intend to have that and I do not know that I should be able to improve upon the rules suggested, but it would be very nearly impossible for any gentleman to point out what it might be, or ought to be, or to improve on it, after he has heard it with his ears and not having seen it, by just asking the clerk to read it afresh. Now that is the rule which requires ,that each ordinance shall be entitled with the section and article which it refers to. I do not know that I use the exact language. Now I take it, we are here to make a Constitution, and not here to amend the present Constitution except as all laws amend existing laws and that may prove to be a very troublesome article. It may be that it will lead to considerable debate and argument as to what are the particular titles of the present Constitution that are affected by others which are offered. I shall support, therefore, the motion of the gentleman from Montgomery to print and lay over for consideration until tomorrow. There will be no delay. I think if the Journal of the Convention is referred to it will be found that the have already ordered standing committees. Am I right, Mr. President?
The President pro tem assented to the statement.
MR. PILLANS--We have ordered the standing committees, precisely in the same order as now stated in the report. The Committee brought in a partial report and we adopted it, and there is nothing to be gained by going further with this report of the Committee.
GOVERNOR OATES--May I inquire of the Chairman of the Committee if there is any rule--I did not notice it if there is--by which the vote is prescribed to change or amend the rules.
MR. KNOX--Two-thirds. That is the usual parliamentary practice.
MR. LOMAX--It requires two-thirds to suspend a rule, but a majority--
MR. KNOX--I beg the gentleman's pardon; it requires two-thirds to suspend a rule, but a majority to amend the rule after one day's notice.
GOVERNOR OATES -- That is much more liberal. Mr. President, I find from the reading but one rule that I doubted, and I have some assurances that will be amended and made more definite, and then, for myself, I do not care for the motion. I think I understand the rules very well and while it is in the possession of the Convention if anybody objects to it I desire to withdraw the motion, but if any one objects, I will not withdraw it--
MR. KNOX--I will state for the information of the Convention that it is the purpose of the Committee on Rules to move an amendment to meet the objection raised by the gentleman from Montgomery as to call for a division, and I might state now that rule three shall be amended so as to provide that upon a vote being taken, the Chair shall announce that one or the other side of the question seems to have, it and wait a reasonable time for a demand for a division, when if no such motion is made, the chair shall state--if no such demand is made, the chair shall announce the result of the vote.
GOVERNOR OATES--I am satisfied with that.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.--The gentleman from Montgomery asked leave to withdraw the motion to postpone until tomorrow, if there is no objection. The chair hears none, and the question is on the motion that the rules of the committee be adopted.
GOVERNOR JONES (Montgomery)--I have no objection to that motion, if I may be permitted to call attention to one rule. Rule 23, I think, requires all resolutions to be referred to the Committee on Rules, or at least I think it is twenty-three.
Rule 23 read.
GOVERNOR JONES--That is not the one. It is the rule that requires all motions to be referred to the Committee on Rules.
MR. KNOX--All resolutions--
GOVERNOR JONES--I hope the Committee will modify that rule. For instance, some gentleman might have a motion that has been referred to the Committee on Rules, and he might wish to offer a resolution to discharge them from the consideration of it, or to compel them to report it. Under the letter of that rule, such resolution would have to be referred to the Committee on Rules.
MR. PETTUS--I rise to a question of information.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.--The gentleman will state his point of inquiry.
MR. PETTUS--Do I understand the amendment proposed by the chairman of the committee has been adopted and incorporated in the rules?
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM--The chair does not understand any amendment has been proposed, but that the chairman has given the convention the information that an amendment will be proposed.
MR. KNOX--I am directed by the Committee on Rules to move to amend Rule 3, which reads as follows: "He shall rise to put a question, but may state it sitting. All questions shall be distinctly put in this form: `Those in favor (as the question may be) say aye, and after the affirmative vote has been expressed, those opposed to the motion say no. Now the committee offers this amendment to be inserted at that place in the rule: "Upon the vote being taken, the chair shall announce that one or the other side of the questions seems to have it, and wait a reasonable time for a demand for a division, when, if no such demand is made, the chair shall state the decision."
The question was put upon the adoption of the amendment, and the amendment was adopted.
GOVERNOR JONES (Montgomery)--Now I would like to have the Secretary read Rule 28:
Rule 28 read.
GOVERNOR JONES -- Now, Mr. President, I submit that that rule is entirely too broad, and that in the progress of the debates and proceedings of this body, numerous points of order will be made on it, and numerous ruling, made which would be avoided by modifying it in such respects. made I have been on Committees on Rules myself, and I do not mind confessing that sometimes members of the Committee on Rules, when there is a proposition that they do not like, or they do not think it is advisable to have aired, to use slang expression, they set down on it. Now, a member may have a proposition before that committee that he wants to get before this House. Certainly he ought not to be required to make a motion to discharge the committee, and then have that motion passed on by that committee. There are other matters, Mr. President; motions relating to the privileges of members or the privileges of the House, and the like, and I hope that the committee will modify that rule in those particulars. I will make the motion myself, Mr. President. I move that that rule be amended by adding "except motions relating to the privileges of the convention or of the members thereof; motions to discharge the Committee on Rules from the consideration of resolutions, or to require them to report a resolution at a given time; motions to reconsider, and motions to adjourn."
The President pro tem. asked that the amendment be reduced to writing.
GOVERNOR JONES (Montgomery)--Mr President, I withdraw the amendment that I offered verbally, and, by consent, move to add to the end of the rule, "Except resolutions relating to the privileges of the convention or its members; the orders of the day; motions to discharge the Committee on Rules from consideration of a resolution, or to order it to report back by a day certain. "Now, I offer that as an amendment to the rule.
MR. BOONE--Don't you think it would be well to put in there, "Resolutions or ordinances" as they seem to draw a distinction between resolutions and ordinances?
MR. KNOX--The committee is willing to accept the amendment offered by the gentleman from Montgomery.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.-- The question is on the adoption of the amendment proposed by the gentleman from Montgomery.
MR. KNOX--The committee accepts the amendment and makes it a part of the original report.
MR. BULGER-- Mr. President, in voting upon these rules sir, I must confess that just hearing one reading, I am not sufficiently familiar with the rules to vote intelligently upon their adoption, and when I come to vote I put my whole faith in the profound confidence I have in this Committee on Rules. So I hope the Convention will pardon me for calling the re-reading of rule 25 on the question of the order and dignity of motions.
Rule 25 was read.
The President pro tem. Stated the question was on the adoption of the rules.
MR. SANFORD-- I ask for a reading of the amendment proposed by the gentleman from Montgomery.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.-- That has been accepted by the Committee on Rules. Do you wish the rule read as amended?
MR. SANFORD- Yes, read it as amended
This was done.
MR. JENKINS--It has always been the practice in the legislature before adopting the rules to have them printed for the information of the members. I do not see how we can vote intelligently to adopt a system fo rules just from hearing them read over as a whole here. I think we ought to postpone the adoption of the rules until they can be printed and placed on the desks of every member, and then each member can decide whether he is satisfied with them as they are or whether he wants to amend any of them. There are some amendments I had in view that I would like to offer, but I am not in a position just now to know how to
vote intelligently on them. I suggest that we postpone the adoption of the rules until they are printed so that we can agree on them and I trust Governor Oates will make that motion--I will myself move that the rules be printed and placed on the desk of each member before adoption.
GOVERNOR OATES--I withdrew that motion awhile ago because I was satisfied with the amendation of Rule 3, but I find that several gentlemen are still in the fog about some of them and do not understand them. Several of them think that the rule requiring a two-thirds vote to call any matter from a committee to which such matter may have been referred is wrong, that it ought to be only a majority vote. I do not recall myself what the number of the rule is. It shows, however, that the motion to postpone and print has a good deal of force in it and a good many of the, delegates want that done. I am perfectly satisfied but a good many of the gentlemen desire that the rules should be printed before adopted. I hope if that is done it will not delay the proceedings for I believe the former action of the Convention authorized the appointment of the committees just as this report from the Committee on Rules so that the proceedings will not be delayed. I don't remember the rule--
THE CLERK--It is 43.
GOVERNOR OATES--Then before a vote is taken I would like to have that rule read.
Rule 43 was read.
MR. JENKINS--That was the main rule I had in view when I made that motion, and if that rule is changed, I am satisfied.
MR. KNOX--Rule 57 provides that on one day's notice any member may propose an amendment to any of these rules. If in the operation of the rules it should at any time be found necessary to make any amendments or alterations, the Convention can do so.
MR. SPEARS--I want to ask the gentleman a question.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.--Does the gentleman yield to a question?
MR. SPEARS--Suppose I give notice to-day that I will introduce a resolution tomorrow to change any rule and that rule is referred to the Committee on Rules, will it take a two-thirds vote of the convention to bring in a report from that committee.
MR. KNOX--The chairman of the committee is of the opinion that it will, to recall any question from a committee, under the rules, requires a two-thirds vote.
MR. SPEARS--I want to ask a further question
MR. SPEARS--Don't that destroy the majority rule or the power of the majority of the convention to change the rules, the fact that it would require two-thirds to take it away from the committee?
MR. KNOX--That is simply assuming that if a sensible proposition were made, the Committee on Rules would oppose it; and I do not think any member has a right to make such an assumption.
GOVERNOR OATES--If the gentleman will allow me, let me suggest an amendment which will obviate all objections. Instead of requiring a two-thirds vote, let it be changed so as to require a majority of the whole number and with that change it will be satisfactory.
MR. KNOX--We ask unanimous consent to change the rule by inserting "a majority" instead of the two-thirds.
The consent was given and the amendment made.
MR. BURNETT--When you accept
the suggestion made by the gentleman from Montgomery, don't you
make it more difficult to secure a change? Suppose there are only
100 members present. Half of 155 would be 78 and you would be
in a worse fix than you would be if you required only two-thirds
MR. KNOX--There is this suggestion: The great work of the convention will be done in Committee, and after a committee has devoted days and days to the consideration of a question and has reached a conclusion that it is unwise, it seems to our Committee better that to take that matter from the Committee and bring it before the body, something more than a mere majority should be required and, therefore, we accept the suggestion from the gentleman from Montgomery. We have been in session since Tuesday and we have done very little and that is the reason this committee on rules is anxious that these rules shall be adopted today in order that the convention may get down to the important work before it. We, therefore, hope that the convention will proceed this morning with the adoption of the rules.
MR. JENKINS--I withdraw the motion to postpone.
Vote being taken viva voce, the report of the committee, as amended, was postponed.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.--The secretary will call the first order of business.
THE CLERK--The roll call, calling alphabetically the roll of delegates to introduce resolutions, memorials-
MR. CUNNINGHAM--I rise to a point of order, under a resolution previously adopted, ordinances and resolutions having reference to the amendment of the Constitution are not in order until the committees have been announced.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.--The Chair is of opinion the point is well taken.
MR. BULGER--I offer a resolution and I move to suspend the rules that it be adopted.
The resolution, which appears later, as offered by Mr. Bulger with reference to education was read.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.-That will go to the proper committee when raised.
MR. GRAHAM (Talladega)-I offer a resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
JOSEPH B. GRAHAM-
Resolved, by this convention that our President is hereby requested to extend an invitation to Dr. Jabez L.. M. Curry of Washington, D. C., to address this convention on the subject of public education at his earliest convenience. The specific time and arrangement to be fixed by the convention upon reply from Dr. Curry.
THE PRESIDENT PRO TEM.-That will be referred to the Committee on Rules.
MR. LOMAX-I move that 500 copies of the rules just adopted be printed for use of gentlemen of the convention.
MR. OATES-In pamphlet form?
MR. LOMAX-I will add in pamphlet form at the suggestion of the gentleman from Montgomery.
The motion was carried.
President Knox here resumed the chair.
MR. COLEMAN (Greene)-I have a resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
First, Resolved, That the rate of taxation relative to the State, counties and municipalities as fixed by the present constitution shall remain unchanged.
Second, No County, sub-division of a County, District or municipality, shall be authorized to issue bonds, or make contract involving pecuniary obligations, which are matured at a later period than twelve months from the date of such issue, or contract, without first having been approved by a majority vote by ballot of the qualified voters of such counties, sub-division, district or municipality; by an affirmative vote in favor of such issue or contract, and in determining the result of any election held for this purpose, no vote shall be counted as an affirmative vote, which does not show on its face that such vote was cast in approval of such issue or contract-any legislative provision to the contrary notwithstanding.
To be referred to proper Committee.
THE PRESIDENT-The Chair will announce the standing committees, and the first gentleman named on any committee will be the chairman of that committee.
The committees were as follows:
Committee on Judiciary--Smith of Mobile, Lowe of Jefferson, Walker, Pillans, Fitts, Watts, Ferguson, Hood, Coleman of Walker, Cobb, Graham of Montgomery, Samford, Willett, Merrill, Tayloe, Leigh, NeSmith, Duke, Espy, Davis of DeKalb, Ashcraft, Wilson of Clarke, Heflin of Randolph, Kirk, Jones of Hale.
Committee on Order, Consistency and Harmony of the Whole Constitution.--White, Selheimer, Spraggins, Jones of Montgomery, Williams of Barbour, Heflin of Chambers, McDonald, Davis of DeKalb, Davis of Etowah, Weakley, Sollie. Craig. Martin, Pillans. Beddow, Moody, Carmichael of Colbert, Foster, Sorrell, deGraffenreid, Norman, McMillan of Wilcox, Sanford. Sentell, Beavers.
Committee on Suffrage and Elections-Coleman
of Greene, White, Miller of Wilcox, Walker, Oates, Weatherly,
Smith of Mobile, Jones of Wilcox, O'Neal of Lauderdale, Stewart,
Howze, Pitts, DeGraffenreid, Morrissette, Rodgers of Lowndes,
Eyster. Glover, Chapman, Graham of Talladega, Grant Hood, Harrison,
Dent, Parker of Cullman, Handley.
Committee on Legislative Department. - Oates, Weatherly. Brooks, Macdonald, Heflin of Chambers, Lowe of Jefferson, NeSmith, Carnathan, King, Leigh, Jackson, Espy, Chapman, Pettus, Lowe of Lawrence, Reese, Rodgers of Sumter, Porter, Sloan.
Committee on Local Legislation - O'Neal of Lauderdale, Watts, Vaughan, Whiteside, Almon, Sanders, Greer of Calhoun, Proctor, Wilson of Washington, Haley, Glover, Burnett, Waddell, Inge, O'Rear, Reynolds of Henry, Kyle, Banks, Reynolds of Chilton.
Committee on Education-Graham of Talladega, Ashcraft, Pettus, Bulger, Jones of Wilcox, Tayloe, Rodgers of Sumter, Robinson, Williams of Barbour, Reese, Renfro, Opp, Miller of Marengo, Inge, Locklin, Hodges, Altman, Bethune, Mac A. Smith.
Committee on Taxation-Browne, Pillans, Harrison, Handley, Craig, Pearce, Kyle, Long of Butler, Searcy, O'Neill of Jefferson, Maxwell, Burnett, Winn, Kirk, Martin, Coleman of Greene, Cunningham, Carnathan, King.
Committee on Executive Department--Jones of Montgomery, Fitts, Lomax, Sanford, Duke, Hodges, Norwood, Smith, M. M., of Autauga, Vaughan, Williams of Marengo, Jenkins, Carmichael of Coffee, Howell, Spears, Hinson.
Committee on Preamble and Declaration of Rights-Lomax, Vaughan, Eyster, Fitts, Wilson of Washington, Brown, Cornwell, Barefield, Bethune, Carden, Carmichael of Coffee, Case, Blackwell, Bartlett, Phillips.
Committee on Corporations-Harrison, Rogers of Lowndes, Searcy, Graham of Montgomery, Coleman of Walker, Wilson of Clarke, Proctor, Ferguson, Williams of Marengo, Opp, Long of Butler, Burnett, Almon, Murphree, Cofer.
Committee on Representation.-Pitts, Williams of Marengo, Bulger, Knight, O'Rear, Grayson, Almon, Greer of Perry, Davis of Etowah, Carden, Jenkins, Greer of Calhoun, Hinson, Norman, Gilmore.
Committee on Exemptions. - Howze, O'Neill of Jefferson, Burns, Selheimer, Sorrell, Heflin of Randolph, Stewart, Morrissette, Long of Walker, Banks, Palmer, Reynolds of Henry, Eley, Grayson, Williams of Elmore.
Committee on Militia.-Wilson of Clarke, Greer of Calhoun, Jones of Montgomery, Spraggins, Burns, Waddell, Henderson, M. M. Smith of Autauga, Sanders, Palmer, Jones of Bibb, King, Williams of Elmore, Stoddard, Freeman.
Committee on Banks and Banking-Fletcher, Handley, Cornwell, Ledbetter, Brooks, McMillan of Baldwin, Malone, Renfroe, Dent, Searcy, Parker of Cullman, Maxwell, Eley, Winn, Reynolds of Chilton.
Committee on Municipal Corporations - Weakley, Boone, Fletcher, McMillan of Baldwin, Beddow, Sanford, Howell, Parker of Elmore, Pearce, Whitesides, Knight, Kirkland, Mulkey, Phillips, Byars.
Committee on State and County Boundaries--Parker of Cullman, Reese, Beavers, Jenkins, Cobb, Miller of Marengo, Sentell, Parker of Elmore, Thompson, Moody, Gilmore, Jackson, McMillan of Wilcox, Malone, Blackwell.
Committee on Impeachments-Hood, Miller of Wilcox, Grant, Haley, Sorrell, Bulger, Lowe of Jefferson, Merrill, Henderson, Long of Walker, Robinson, Mac A. Smith of Autauga, Thompson, Willett, Cofer.
Committee on Amending the Constitution and Miscellaneous Provisions-Foster, Merrill, Jones of Hale, Boone, Altman, Burns, Ledbetter, Norwood, Haley, Cunningham, Sollie. Sentell, Barefield, Lowe of Lawrence, McMillan of Wilcox.
Committee on the Journal-Proctor, Wilson of Clarke, Carmichael of Colbert, Kirkland, Foshee.
Committee on Schedule, Printing and Incidental Expenses-Heflin of Randolph, Greer of Perry, Locklin, Wilson of Washington, Barefield, Henderson, Carmichael of Coffee, Murphree, Joneof Bibb.
THE PRESIDENT-The regular order of business will be the calling of the roll. Calling alphabetically the roll of the delegates to introduce resolutions, memorials, petitions, ordinances and their proper references.
The roll was called.
MR. BOONE-I offer a resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
Resolved, That the Secretary of this convention be, and is hereby, instructed to reserve five copies of printed stenographic reports of the proceedings of this convention, and when said report is completed, cause the same to be bound and deposited in the office of the Secretary of State.
Referred to Schedule, Printing and Incidental Expenses Committee.
MR. WATTS-I have a resolution on that same subject which I would like to have take the same course.
The resolution was read as follows:
Resolved, That the official stenographer be required to deliver each day to the Secretary of State 250 of the 1,000 printed copies of the report of the proceedings of the convention for the previous day.
Resolved further, That it should be the duty of the Secretary of State to preserve said 250 copies of said proceedings for such use as the General Assembly may direct.
MR. BROOKS--I have a resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
To Amend Sec. 3 of Article 11 of the Constitution.
Resolved, That Section 3 of Article 11 of the Constitution be amended so that it shall read as follows:
After the ratification of this constitution, no new debt shall be created against, or incurred by, this State or its authority, except to repel invasion, or to suppress insurrection, and then only by a concurrence of two-thirds of the members of each house of the General Assembly, and the vote shall be taken by yeas and nays, and entered on the journals; and any act creating, or incurring any new debt against this State, except as herein provided for, shall be absolutely void; provided, the Governor may be authorized to negotiate temporary loans, never to exceed three hundred thousand dollars, to meet deficiencies in the treasury; and until the same is paid, no new loan shall be negotiated; provided, further, that this section shall not be so construed as to prevent the refunding, from time to time, of the bonded indebtedness of the State.
The resolution was referred to the Committee on Taxation.
MR. BROOKS---I desire to call the attention of the Chair to the fact that there is another committee which all motions, ordinances or resolutions to amend the constitution shall be submitted and I would like to have the ruling of the Chair on the point. This is a motion to amend, not an original ordinance or something outside of the constitution.
THE PRESIDENT--The Chair understands that all motions and all propositions that will be submitted will relate to amendments to the constitution because the call of this convention is so expressed "To amend, alter or change the Constitution."
MR. BROOKS---I have another resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
Resolved, That Section 1, of Article 12 of the Constitution be so amended that it shall read as follows:
1. All able bodied male inhabitants
of this State, between the ages of 18 years, and 45 years, who
are citizens of the United States, or have declared their intention
to become such citizens, shall be liable to military duties in
the militia of the State. And the General Assembly may provide
for the organization from
among such citizens of a State Naval Militia.
Referred to Committee on Militia.
THE PRESIDENT--The Chair would state to the convention that under the rules adopted, propositions for the amendment of the Constitution will be called ordinances and other propositions, resolutions. That rule was adopted for the convenience of the clerks in keeping a record of the proceedings of the convention.
MR. BROOKS-In the absence of any rule, I merely put it in the form of a resolution. I noticed that was the form in which the federal convention put it. I have another resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
Resolved, That Section 23 of Article 14 of the Constitution be stricken out, and the following substituted:
No public officer, or person elected or appointed to a public office under the laws of this State, shall directly or indirectly ask, demand, accept, receive or consent to receive for his own use or benefit, or for the use or benefit of another, any free pass, free transportation, franking privilege or discrimination in passenger, telegraph or telephone rates, from any person or corporation, or make use of same himself or in conjunction with another. A person who violates any provision of this section, shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor, and shall forfeit his office at the suit of the Attorney General. Any corporation, or officer, or agent thereof. who shall offer, or promise to a public officer, or person elected or appointed to a public office, any such free pass, free transportation, franking privilege or discrimination, shall also be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor, and is liable to punishment except as herein provided. No person, or officer or agent of a corporation giving any such free pass, free transportation, franking privilege or discrimination hereby prohibited, shall be privileged from testifying in relation thereto, and he shall not be liable to civil or criminal prosecution therefor, if he shall testify to the giving of the same.
Referred to Committee on Corporations.
MR. BROOKS--I wish to say that resolution or amendment is not original with me. I copied it literally from the New York Constitution of 1895.
MR. BROWNE-I have an ordinance.
The ordinance was read as follows:
An ordinance to amend Section 1 of Article 13 of the Constitution. (Relates to Public Schools.)
Be it ordained that Section 1 of Article 13 of the Constitution of 1875 be, and the same is hereby amended to read as follows:
Section 1. The General of Assembly shall establish, organize and maintain, a system of public schools throughout the State for
the benefit of the children thereof, between the ages of 7 and 21 years; Provided, separate schools of the same length of term as those provided for other children, shall be provided for the children of African descent.
Referred to Committee on Education.
Mr. Bulger's resolution heretofore handed in was read as follows:
Resolved, That whereas, The prosperity and welfare of our State depends upon the intelligence and integrity of our people.
That whereas, In the past few years we have made rapid and permanent progress in providing facilities for educating the children of our State. Therefore, be it
Resolved, It is the sense of this Convention that no backward step in education shall be taken, but this grand work will go on until a free public school is placed within reach of every white child in Alabama.
Referred to Committee on Taxation.
MR. BURNS-I have a resolution: That the present limit of taxation, State, county and city shall not be increased.
Referred to Committee on Taxation.
The resolution of Mr. Coleman (Greene), heretofore read, was referred to Committee on Municipal Corporations.
MR. EYSTER-I have a resolution: Resolved, that the names of the various committees be printed in the same pamphlet heretofore ordered printed to contain the Rules of this Convention.
MR. EYSTER-I move that the rules be suspended and that that resolution be put on its passage.
A vote being taken the rules were suspended.
DR. CUNNINGHAM-I want to amend the original motion by inserting the names of the officers of the Convention also.
A vote being taken the amendment was adopted.
DR. CUNNINGHAM-I also move that an alphabetical list of the delegates and the Country or District they represent and their postoffice addresses be inserted.
This amendment was adopted and a vote being taken the resolution as amended was agreed to.
MR. GREER (Calhoun)-I move that we adjourn until tomorrow morning at 11 o'clock.
GOVERNOR JONES-Will the gentleman allow me to make a suggestion? There are a good many resolutions and ordinances the gentlemen would like to order and I move that they be sent up to the clerk's desk and be printed. This motion was withdrawn immediately as was also the motion of the delegate from Calhoun to adjourn.
GENERAL HARRISON--I have a resolution.
The resolution was read as follows:
An ordinance to prohibit vagrants from voting in this State.
First-Be it ordained by the people of Alabama in Convention assembled, that no vagrant, as now defined by the statutes of Alabama, shall be allowed to vote at any election in this State.
The resolution was referred to the Committee on Suffrage and Election.
MR. HENDERSON-I offer a resolution.
Resolved, That the new Constitution provide that the General Assembly of Alabama shall have no power to enact any law in aid of our pertaining to the removal of the seat of government of this State from where it is now located.
Referred to the Committee on Legislative Department.
Mr. Henderson also offered the following resolution.
Resolved, That it be provided by the new Constitution, that representation in the General Assembly be based on population of all the people.
Referred to Committee on Representation.
MR. WILSON (Clarke)-I move that the Convention adjourn until tomorrow morning at 11 o'clock.
The motion was seconded and was carried and the Convention adjourned accordingly.